Tulsa

[cincyguy13]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

In my opinion, there is a difference in mid major players.

Guys like eliel nsesome translate to any level because they rebound, defend & play hard.

Guys like Chris Vogt and Rap, don’t translate because they lack those effort and toughness skills while also lacking athletic ability.

Not trolling, do you not see the inconsistency of your argument?

[TheLivingLegend]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

In my opinion, there is a difference in mid major players.

Guys like eliel nsesome translate to any level because they rebound, defend & play hard.

Guys like Chris Vogt and Rap, don’t translate because they lack those effort and toughness skills while also lacking athletic ability.

Your opinion.. per usual. Is wrong.

[justinhub2003]

Originally Posted by TheLivingLegend

Your opinion.. per usual. Is wrong.

Ask any scout if defense and rebounding translate to all levels. Almost all with agree.

If add athleticism with rebounding and defensive ability it certainly translates.

Guys who are slow, unathletic and don’t have a high motor will struggle at the high major.

Case in point... Chris Vogt

Now look at elie... his defensive rebounding % was actually higher at UC than Georgia state. But they are close enough to call them the same.


He also offensive rebounded pretty well at UC and then once he stepped down a level, he’s now the 17th best offensive rebounder in the country,


Chris Vogt is an aweful rebounder.

[TheLivingLegend]

Yes. With eliel on this team we are national championship bound!

[cincyguy13]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

Ask any scout if defense and rebounding translate to all levels. Almost all with agree.

If add athleticism with rebounding and defensive ability it certainly translates.

Guys who are slow, unathletic and don’t have a high motor will struggle at the high major.

Case in point... Chris Vogt

Now look at elie... his defensive rebounding % was actually higher at UC than Georgia state. But they are close enough to call them the same.


He also offensive rebounded pretty well at UC and then once he stepped down a level, he’s now the 17th best offensive rebounder in the country,


Chris Vogt is an aweful rebounder.

Vogt sucks, that’s not point. The point was, you guys talk about how loaded the roster was, “so many returning players”, blah blah blah, but don’t mention how every single player except brooks ended up at a mid major. Mid major is also something that you love to discredit and have since brannen was hired But now it’s ok for some reason.

[justinhub2003]

Originally Posted by TheLivingLegend

Yes. With eliel on this team we are national championship bound!

Not what I said. But with Elie this team defends better, rebounds better and protects the paint better.

Not even sure how thats even up for debate Debate.


Chris Vogt is the worst Big man defender that UC has had in the Huggins/Brannen/Cronin era.


You know it too

[cincyguy13]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

Ask any scout if defense and rebounding translate to all levels. Almost all with agree.

If add athleticism with rebounding and defensive ability it certainly translates.

Guys who are slow, unathletic and don’t have a high motor will struggle at the high major.

Case in point... Chris Vogt

Now look at elie... his defensive rebounding % was actually higher at UC than Georgia state. But they are close enough to call them the same.


He also offensive rebounded pretty well at UC and then once he stepped down a level, he’s now the 17th best offensive rebounder in the country,


Chris Vogt is an aweful rebounder.

If you are saying Ellie us elite at something? Or at least good. If the madsens are elite shooters, and have value, isn’t the the same thing? Why were you so quick to write off them and call them mid major but Ellie you’re fine with being mid major level.

[Bcatfollower]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

Not what I said. But with Elie this team defends better, rebounds better and protects the paint better.

Not even sure how thats even up for debate Debate.


Chris Vogt is the worst Big man defender that UC has had in the Huggins/Brannen/Cronin era.


You know it too

Only because kelvin gaines couldn’t even get on the court.

[justinhub2003]

Originally Posted by cincyguy13

If you are saying Ellie us elite at something? Or at least good. If the madsens are elite shooters, and have value, isn’t the the same thing? Why were you so quick to write off them and call them mid major but Ellie you’re fine with being mid major level.

Because my personal belief around modern basketball is that I want toughness, rebounding and defense from my Bigs.

I don't mind them being a little one sided when it comes to skillset.


I think college basketball is won at the guard level. And while you can have a few non defenders in your guard rotation, you need most of them to be 2 way contributors. And if you do have really awful guard defenders then you better have a great rim protecting big.

There is all kinds of defense and rebounding first bigs in the NBA that contribute to winning teams because they have elite guard play.


Elie IS a good/ better than most rebounder. He's 17th in the Nation in offensive rebounding rate right now.


Good roster construction doesn't just mean guys who are skilled offensively at every spot. You need balance. You need a few lockdown defenders like Kevin Johnson.. Not just all scorers.

[cincyguy13]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

Because my personal belief around modern basketball is that I want toughness, rebounding and defense from my Bigs.

I don't mind them being a little one sided when it comes to skillset.


I think college basketball is won at the guard level. And while you can have a few non defenders in your guard rotation, you need most of them to be 2 way contributors. And if you do have really awful guard defenders then you better have a great rim protecting big.

There is all kinds of defense and rebounding first bigs in the NBA that contribute to winning teams because they have elite guard play.


Elie IS a good/ better than most rebounder. He's 17th in the Nation in offensive rebounding rate right now.


Good roster construction doesn't just mean guys who are skilled offensively at every spot. You need balance. You need a few lockdown defenders like Kevin Johnson.. Not just all scorers.

I don’t care about Ellie. He’s fine, he’s a mid major player. Exactly what you claim you didn’t want but seem to be fine with if cronin got them. This team isn’t going anywhere with or without Ellie. And the roster was loaded with “mid major” players. Things that you didn’t really like until I pointed out