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Old 12-10-2019, 09:04 PM   #311
cincrulz11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinhub2003 View Post
Ok.

Go check out where Chris Vogt was when Goodin threw down a viscous dunk.

Top of the key doing god knows what with jones

the one Vogt went to hedge for the screen and Goodin crossed MAW right?



so you think our center is supposed to come out to the 3 point line to hedge against a pnr, and when the guard gets crossed over he's then supposed to get all the way back to the lane to block a guard going full speed?


the funny thing is i knew you were going to say that play, and its hilarious thats an example of vogt being an awful defender..
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:14 AM   #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cincrulz11 View Post
the one Vogt went to hedge for the screen and Goodin crossed MAW right?



so you think our center is supposed to come out to the 3 point line to hedge against a pnr, and when the guard gets crossed over he's then supposed to get all the way back to the lane to block a guard going full speed?


the funny thing is i knew you were going to say that play, and its hilarious thats an example of vogt being an awful defender..

No. I’m saying Vogt should never ever ever leave the paint.

When he does bad things will happen.


My point is his slow footed defense should never be put in situation where he is taken out of position.

Like why are you following tyrique Jones our near the 3 point line?


But if the hill you wanna die on is that Chris Vogt is a good defender, then be my guest. Everyone knows he’s not . He’s good at being 7 ft but when we need a little more then that, we can’t get it.


No blame on him. Just the staff needs to 1 man zone him. I mean what’s the harm in tyrique Jones being at the top of the key
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:15 AM   #313
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But I also haven’t watched the film yet.

I don’t want to watch either. They kicked our ass in the 2nd half.


If I get the balls to do it later, I’ll make a few clips out of it
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:58 AM   #314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinhub2003 View Post
No. I’m saying Vogt should never ever ever leave the paint.

When he does bad things will happen.


My point is his slow footed defense should never be put in situation where he is taken out of position.

Like why are you following tyrique Jones our near the 3 point line?


But if the hill you wanna die on is that Chris Vogt is a good defender, then be my guest. Everyone knows he’s not . He’s good at being 7 ft but when we need a little more then that, we can’t get it.


No blame on him. Just the staff needs to 1 man zone him. I mean what’s the harm in tyrique Jones being at the top of the key


all i stated was that teams aren't abusing his defense. if you want to say they're abusing our guards inability to stay in front of their man, then you can say that, but thats not really Vogt's fault.


If you want to let Marshall have his defender picked so he gets free 3's or 14 footers then I guess thats a strat we could have. Wouldn't be the worst letting Marshall have open 3's but Im not sure putting him at the top of the key without a defender is something that would work out well? Do teams typically try that on pnr?



If Vogt was out there letting them get past him on his hedge, then that is 100% on Vogt and would be terrible. But when you watch the times our guard actually pushing their ball handler towards the hedge, Vogt played it well and xavier passed out. We were abused against the pnr when our guards got crossed over repeatedly when xavier denied the screen.



If what happened vs x happened in a mick cronin defense, mick cronin would be furious with the defense from the guard.



i have said repeatedly here that Vogt struggles when pulled away from the basket. When he has to help and then his man leaks out he struggles a great deal with recovering. But 7 footers that don't struggle with that are rare, and ones that can do that and score like Vogt can are almost nonexistent and they play in the NBA once they are old enough to.
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:00 AM   #315
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Originally Posted by justinhub2003 View Post
But I also haven’t watched the film yet.

I don’t want to watch either. They kicked our ass in the 2nd half.


If I get the balls to do it later, I’ll make a few clips out of it

Please do, and note the 8:05 Goodin dunk and the 6:15 Marshall drive at who actually made the mistake on defense and what our defensive design is.
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:16 AM   #316
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Originally Posted by sedziobs View Post
If you think people here are saying Vogt has good foot speed and quickness, then I'm not sure we're reading the same thread.
It's just a weak straw man argument to pretend others are saying something they are not. Vogt was not brought here to be a lock down perimeter defender. Everyone knows he is not Justin Jackson or even Diara in athletic ability.

That does not mean he's not the better option for the team overall. Brannen seems to think Vogt gives him more of what he needs and Diara is not even 2nd in line when Sorolla is back.

I hope Diara figures it ALL out for our sake. There is upside with him but if mental aspects of the game are holding him back...he may never reach his upside. The downside is also pretty clear. Low floor...fairly high ceiling. Vogt is high floor low ceiling. Vogt is already doing MOST of what he can do. He's not going to become a shooter or athletic.

Last edited by waterhead; 12-11-2019 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 12-11-2019, 10:23 AM   #317
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Can I ask a question why in the hell, is anybody going back and watching tape on this team?... At this point we could only hope to be on the bubble. The season is over... Better start making plans for next yr. Let's talk about next yr and what we're gonna need to do in order to avoid a 3 yr tournament drought possibly 4. What is there to talk about right now besides how bad we are. N besides Coaching or recruiting possibilities we might as well start looking right now. I hope they are looking now. Keith Williams is on the rise by the way tho. He and a healthy Cumberland and a full supporting cast might of had a chance to make a run this yr bc I'm not seeing any dominate team to be scared of
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Old 12-11-2019, 10:10 PM   #318
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Originally Posted by JoeRunner89 View Post
Can I ask a question why in the hell, is anybody going back and watching tape on this team?... At this point we could only hope to be on the bubble. The season is over... Better start making plans for next yr. Let's talk about next yr and what we're gonna need to do in order to avoid a 3 yr tournament drought possibly 4. What is there to talk about right now besides how bad we are. N besides Coaching or recruiting possibilities we might as well start looking right now. I hope they are looking now. Keith Williams is on the rise by the way tho. He and a healthy Cumberland and a full supporting cast might of had a chance to make a run this yr bc I'm not seeing any dominate team to be scared of
Give me a f'n break... we're 10 games in and the season is over?
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Old 12-11-2019, 10:30 PM   #319
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Originally Posted by cincrulz11 View Post
Please do, and note the 8:05 Goodin dunk and the 6:15 Marshall drive at who actually made the mistake on defense and what our defensive design is.
You’re missing my entire point.

We know two things: our guards can’t guard

And our big is only good at guarding around the rim.

So why we we letting a non shooting threat like tyrique jones bring our 7 footer out to where he is least affecting especially when we already know his defiencies on defense.


I just want to be clear of what your trying to say... you’re saying Chris Vogt is a great defender ? And that we utilized him perfectly ?
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Old 12-12-2019, 09:07 AM   #320
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Remember i pumped my brakes after realizing Brannen didnt have a relationship with Curtis. Wouldve thought nku was competing with uc in recruiting the way Mick was bashed and Brannen was praised.
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