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Old 11-11-2022, 08:58 AM   #11
TheLivingLegend
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Pretty tough game to watch.

We have issues stopping the dribble drive, zero rim protection when it's broke down and rebounding.

Vik played well.

DD is still the guy.

If davenport is going to continue to take horrible shots he needs to sit.

Hensley showed a spark. If he wants minutes he needs to become a rebounding machine. That's how he finds minutes.

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Old 11-11-2022, 01:58 PM   #12
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It's way too early yet for too many hot takes. I remember last year Vik looked like an all star early on. He still looks a little lost on the double. But he does a lot of good things right and I hope he keeps it going this year. When he hits the meat of the schedule he has to figure out how to play that double.

In terms of plus minus so far Kalu is the only player well behind the rest in terms of positive points and minutes played. Two games yes...but he's only +2 in games we won by 43 and 11 points. Everyone else (non walk ons) are at +13 (Newman one game) or above. I don't know what's going on when he's on the court but so far it hasn't been good. I hope that changes very soon.
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Old 11-11-2022, 02:54 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
I wish that when they are struggling against a pushed defense like this that the coach would make them run more set plays. At least then there are plans for where people are supposed to be instead of guys guessing their spots for the system.
I think Wes was quoted at half time as saying "they aren't letting us get into our plays". And I think that was obvious. They had ball pressure out to half court and it was very good ball pressure (and traps). What I think we needed were guards or anyone who could break through that front line of D. DDJ was one of the only one's who could do that consistently. I think Nolley will be okay at it but the PG's are a concern right now.
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Old 11-11-2022, 03:12 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by waterhead View Post
It's way too early yet for too many hot takes. I remember last year Vik looked like an all star early on. He still looks a little lost on the double. But he does a lot of good things right and I hope he keeps it going this year. When he hits the meat of the schedule he has to figure out how to play that double.

In terms of plus minus so far Kalu is the only player well behind the rest in terms of positive points and minutes played. Two games yes...but he's only +2 in games we won by 43 and 11 points. Everyone else (non walk ons) are at +13 (Newman one game) or above. I don't know what's going on when he's on the court but so far it hasn't been good. I hope that changes very soon.
I'd argue that Chaminade should not count stats wise. Only games vs D1 teams should count. EvanMiya only counts the Cleveland State game.

It's too early to read much into +/- or other numbers. +/- is not very accurate over a small sample size because it is heavily influenced by luck.

EvanMiya has Kalu as worst on the team in offensive efficiency, at 72.6, below Phinisee who is at 79.5 (Hensley is third worst at 91.0). This hints he has had bad luck. They are both probably at least 15-20 points lower right now than they end up at the end of the season.

How much is bad luck and how much is bad play we'll find out as the sample size gets larger. Both Kalu and Phinisee were among the worst of their team in offensive efficiency last year (and defensive as well in Kalu's case).

Last edited by skyblade; 11-11-2022 at 03:45 PM.
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Old 11-11-2022, 03:48 PM   #15
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The PG's and backup centers are the biggest concerns. Vik still needs to improve in some aspects, but with his potential I'd say let him play through it even if we had someone close to his level on the team. With this team it seems like there's no choice but to let him learn on the go, Ody/Kalu have been bad.

I still think DDJ at PG is the way to go. MAW has improved, but probably not enough to justify playing him over Newman/Hensley. Phinisee just doesn't really offer anything on offense.
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Old 11-11-2022, 06:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyblade View Post
I'd argue that Chaminade should not count stats wise. Only games vs D1 teams should count. EvanMiya only counts the Cleveland State game.

It's too early to read much into +/- or other numbers. +/- is not very accurate over a small sample size because it is heavily influenced by luck.

EvanMiya has Kalu as worst on the team in offensive efficiency, at 72.6, below Phinisee who is at 79.5 (Hensley is third worst at 91.0). This hints he has had bad luck. They are both probably at least 15-20 points lower right now than they end up at the end of the season.

How much is bad luck and how much is bad play we'll find out as the sample size gets larger. Both Kalu and Phinisee were among the worst of their team in offensive efficiency last year (and defensive as well in Kalu's case).
Well this is the 4th and 5th year for a lot of these guys. We can look at all the metrics we want on Rob and Kalu etc. I am familiar with the problems of small sample sizes it's just some preliminary info that seems to agree with a much longer trend that covers years. Kalu has not been good on D overall but I thought maybe Wes could get something extra out of him. Rob has never been very good on offense and I was not expecting that to change.
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Old 11-11-2022, 06:40 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyblade View Post
The PG's and backup centers are the biggest concerns. Vik still needs to improve in some aspects, but with his potential I'd say let him play through it even if we had someone close to his level on the team. With this team it seems like there's no choice but to let him learn on the go, Ody/Kalu have been bad.

I still think DDJ at PG is the way to go. MAW has improved, but probably not enough to justify playing him over Newman/Hensley. Phinisee just doesn't really offer anything on offense.
Vik has the advantage in a lot of areas. Probably the best rebounder, might be the best scorer, Likely best shot blocker, he's the tallest, Has the best instincts etc. Wes says he's been the best on both sides of the ball (but he may have been last year too). He fell off pace last year and I hope like hell the real version is more like what we are seeing now and early last year. But the real test for Vik will be in Maui. He can pass the ball too (behind the back) but he just has to figure out how to Gary Clark that double down and battle inside with bigger dudes. I like what I have seen so far.
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Old 11-11-2022, 07:16 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by waterhead View Post
Well this is the 4th and 5th year for a lot of these guys. We can look at all the metrics we want on Rob and Kalu etc. I am familiar with the problems of small sample sizes it's just some preliminary info that seems to agree with a much longer trend that covers years. Kalu has not been good on D overall but I thought maybe Wes could get something extra out of him. Rob has never been very good on offense and I was not expecting that to change.
Yeah I agree, the trend does not look good. It's actually surprising how much one games worth of data follows last years trends for quite a few guys.

Some other trends from last year that continued into game one:

Davenport was our top player in +/- and on-off margin, despite most thinking he played poorly.

MAW was also one of our top players.

DDJ was negative in on-off margin and barely positive in efficiency.

Ody was very positive on offense and very negative on defense.
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Old 11-12-2022, 08:22 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by waterhead View Post
In terms of plus minus so far Kalu is the only player well behind the rest in terms of positive points and minutes played. Two games yes...but he's only +2 in games we won by 43 and 11 points. Everyone else (non walk ons) are at +13 (Newman one game) or above. I don't know what's going on when he's on the court but so far it hasn't been good. I hope that changes very soon.
I thought Kalu played well the first game and obviously not so much against CSU. If the stats show JD having a net positive game then I think it's time to start questioning the stats. That may have been one of his worst games as a Bearcat. He was absolutely abused on defense. His one good play (block) came after a dumb play (saving the ball under your own basket)

Quote:
Originally Posted by waterhead View Post
I think Wes was quoted at half time as saying "they aren't letting us get into our plays". And I think that was obvious. They had ball pressure out to half court and it was very good ball pressure (and traps). What I think we needed were guards or anyone who could break through that front line of D. DDJ was one of the only one's who could do that consistently. I think Nolley will be okay at it but the PG's are a concern right now.
One of our PG's isn't quick and can't dribble to his right. Every team should be pressuring us. Wes needs to figure that out, it wasn't any different last year.
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Old 11-12-2022, 09:14 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by TheLongHaul View Post
I thought Kalu played well the first game and obviously not so much against CSU. If the stats show JD having a net positive game then I think it's time to start questioning the stats. That may have been one of his worst games as a Bearcat. He was absolutely abused on defense. His one good play (block) came after a dumb play (saving the ball under your own basket)

Wes gave Davenport the game ball post game, apparently he doesn't give out game balls every game. Said something like Davenport continued to play hard and do the right things despite missing shots.

If Wes says that, perhaps the fans are missing something. One is that the matchup was simply a bad one for him. The other is likely that the rest of the defense wasn't rotating or helping properly.

It's interesting that the +/- reflects Wes's view. I think I'll believe him, even if I saw Davenport get beat with my own eyes. I said last year and continue to think this year that Davenport stands out because when he gets beat, it's very obvious (straight up man-to-man). But I suspect that he doesn't get enough credit for when he does get stops (his man finished 7-19 shooting) or for his help defense.
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