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Old 12-01-2019, 05:09 PM   #121
HongKongPhooey
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Originally Posted by skyblade View Post
Mostly it's because of comparisons to Brooks. Yes, Vogt has played well on offense - but he has been horrible at offensive rebounding - he has 2 offensive rebounds in his last 100+ minutes of play - and not great on the boards. Brooks was a very good all around player, Vogt is excellent at scoring when posted deep, but average to a liability in most other aspects.

Jaevin is very similar at guard. Excellent at offense, but average defensively and can't rebound. The difference is that people aren't comparing Jaevin to a guy who was very good in all three aspects (not sure we've had a guard who is a very good scorer, rebounder and defender lately, maybe Caupain). If people were, I'd be pointing out the difference there as well.
Not saying he will keep it up but so far vogt getting 18.9 points 10.1 boards 1.8 blocks per 40 min Brooks last year 14.0 11.0 and 2.5 I think Brooks rebounding ability in comparison to vogt so far is minimal and considering a good amount of people on here said vogt wasn't even a back up center should be thrilled with his play
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Old 12-01-2019, 07:25 PM   #122
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Gotta say I’m impressed with mcneals body language on the bench when he’s going through this slump, when players aren’t performing well and have an attitude about it, it can be a cancer to the team, McNeal is the was genuinely cheering the team on yesterday even though his minutes got taken away from him by maw.

I think maw has looked really good the last 2 games and I’m excited to see what he can do, but a lot of people seem to be giving up on McNeal, that game against bowling green definitely hurt his confidence, but I think as the season goes on he will still be solid for us

That being said I think maw has played a lot better than him the last 2 games, but I think McNeal is in a slump is all
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Old 12-01-2019, 07:36 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by HongKongPhooey View Post
Not saying he will keep it up but so far vogt getting 18.9 points 10.1 boards 1.8 blocks per 40 min Brooks last year 14.0 11.0 and 2.5 I think Brooks rebounding ability in comparison to vogt so far is minimal and considering a good amount of people on here said vogt wasn't even a back up center should be thrilled with his play
In our 5 games against teams that are better than 199 kenpom, Vogt has averaged less than 1 (0.8) offensive rebound per game and slightly over 5 (5.2) rebounds per game.

I know you can call that cherry picking, but Alabama A&M and Illinois St. were the two worst and most undersized teams we have faced. 12 of his 16 offensive rebounds came in those two games and almost half (23) of his 49 total rebounds also came in those two games.
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Old 12-01-2019, 07:41 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by mdchick View Post
Gotta say I’m impressed with mcneals body language on the bench when he’s going through this slump, when players aren’t performing well and have an attitude about it, it can be a cancer to the team, McNeal is the was genuinely cheering the team on yesterday even though his minutes got taken away from him by maw.

I think maw has looked really good the last 2 games and I’m excited to see what he can do, but a lot of people seem to be giving up on McNeal, that game against bowling green definitely hurt his confidence, but I think as the season goes on he will still be solid for us

That being said I think maw has played a lot better than him the last 2 games, but I think McNeal is in a slump is all
I have disliked McNeal since we signed him. He is historically a bad percentage, high-volume 3-point shooter who isn't great at assist to TO ratio. Sure his poor FT shooting is a slump, but his poor 3 point shooting and poor Assist/TO ratios aren't so much slump, as what he has been his entire career. The jump in competition causes those numbers to drop even farther.

Sure maybe he could get up to 30% from 3, but with his poor shooting and not that great decision making I don't think he should be on the floor anyway. Maw has shown he can shoot significantly better than McNeal, rebound better than McNeal and defend at a comparable level. I don't see anything that McNeal does better than Maw, but I see a lot that Maw does better than McNeal.
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Old 12-01-2019, 10:07 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by skyblade View Post
In our 5 games against teams that are better than 199 kenpom, Vogt has averaged less than 1 (0.8) offensive rebound per game and slightly over 5 (5.2) rebounds per game.

I know you can call that cherry picking, but Alabama A&M and Illinois St. were the two worst and most undersized teams we have faced. 12 of his 16 offensive rebounds came in those two games and almost half (23) of his 49 total rebounds also came in those two games.
You can say the same about Brooks and his stats. He was usually garbage against the best teams we played last year.
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Old 12-01-2019, 10:22 PM   #126
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This is far from “historically horrible.” At least don’t make things up.
When the hell did I say it was historically horrible?
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Old 12-01-2019, 10:37 PM   #127
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You can say the same about Brooks and his stats. He was usually garbage against the best teams we played last year.
Brooks' top shot blocking games were against Wichita St, SMU, East Carolina, Tulsa and NKU. He also had 2 blocks against OSU, Houston, Wichita, UConn, UCLA, and Memphis among others.

His top OREB games were against Houston, Wichita, SMU, and Memphis and had 4 OREB against OSU, UCF, Houston, and Temple among others.

His top scoring games included UCLA, Houston, UConn, Wichita, and Memphis.

He had some bad games against good teams, and some good games against good teams. He certainly didn't show a tendency to feast on weak teams, and it is not accurate to say that he was usually garbage against the best teams.
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Old 12-02-2019, 02:26 AM   #128
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Hello. Long time fan. Have read this board for quite a while. Finally registered so I can give my two cents worth. Lol. It’s been an interesting board this year I must say.
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Old 12-02-2019, 05:14 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by Emperor Snapper View Post
When the hell did I say it was historically horrible?
You didn’t, justinhub did. Was just using your post to say it wasn’t that bad.
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Old 12-02-2019, 05:18 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by skyblade View Post
In our 5 games against teams that are better than 199 kenpom, Vogt has averaged less than 1 (0.8) offensive rebound per game and slightly over 5 (5.2) rebounds per game.

I know you can call that cherry picking, but Alabama A&M and Illinois St. were the two worst and most undersized teams we have faced. 12 of his 16 offensive rebounds came in those two games and almost half (23) of his 49 total rebounds also came in those two games.
You’re trying really hard to put Vogt down. It’s weird.
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