2016-2017 Season

[waterhead]

Originally Posted by ZCat

I'm hopeful for a big year. But I personally don't think we can assume that everyone will improve. Sometimes players improve others Plateau other's regress. Sometimes there's a pleasant surprise sometimes there's an unpleasant surprise. Look at Ellis last year. That's my respectful opinion.

I agree...certain players will get better and some will not. It all comes down to attitude really. Based on that I would guess we may not get as much out of Moore and not sure on Jenifer. Some kids feel they have done enough to deserve playing time when the coach has a different point of view. I think Morman is an example of that frustration.

Caupain has improved a little every year...I expect another similar progression from him which would make him extremely good. Clark has the right frame of mind but would love to see him get a little mean/aggressive. That would do a world of good for him. I think Evans will take a big step just because he will get more minutes and can stay in the flow.

I don't expect a big jump from Moore, Jenifer or KJ (I hope I am wrong). Jenifer may be a little happier this year because he will get some minutes due to lack of depth on the wing. If KJ can improve his 3 % I would be happy with that. I hope Moore works on his footwork and mental approach.

Can't wait to see what the new players bring. Scott, Brooks, Cumberland, Washington. I'm excited about Washington from an attitude and team chemistry standpoint. We all are waiting to see what Cumberland can do. I am starting to think Scott and Brooks will do just fine from a back up minutes defense and rebounding standpoint.

Worried about lack of depth on wing and bench scoring at the 4-5 when starters are out. Deberry was a nice option to have. This team has a lot of potential if we can avoid significant injury or at least be healthy at the right time.

[jacobkdoyle]

Originally Posted by GarradJ21

You're right...would suck to lose all the games we are all looking forward to but oh well. one is entitled to an opinion so my apologies to spinal. I cant go into thinking any game is a loss besides maybe duke.

I will tell you I watched the Bengals game with Gary Clark we have a really good mutual friend. Can't tell you all what he said I dont want to be that guy but a lot of positives coming from that guy and he really is a very nice well,mannered dude

Good to know that Clark is a good guy.

If the positives were basketball related, there are 350 other teams with players feeling the same way. That's the thing about the offseason/preseason, no one has faced any adversity yet. Not saying he shouldn't feel that way, it just isn't unique to our guys.

[jacobkdoyle]

Originally Posted by waterhead

I agree...certain players will get better and some will not. It all comes down to attitude really. Based on that I would guess we may not get as much out of Moore and not sure on Jenifer. Some kids feel they have done enough to deserve playing time when the coach has a different point of view. I think Morman is an example of that frustration.

Caupain has improved a little every year...I expect another similar progression from him which would make him extremely good. Clark has the right frame of mind but would love to see him get a little mean/aggressive. That would do a world of good for him. I think Evans will take a big step just because he will get more minutes and can stay in the flow.

I don't expect a big jump from Moore, Jenifer or KJ (I hope I am wrong). Jenifer may be a little happier this year because he will get some minutes due to lack of depth on the wing. If KJ can improve his 3 % I would be happy with that. I hope Moore works on his footwork and mental approach.

Can't wait to see what the new players bring. Scott, Brooks, Cumberland, Washington. I'm excited about Washington from an attitude and team chemistry standpoint. We all are waiting to see what Cumberland can do. I am starting to think Scott and Brooks will do just fine from a back up minutes defense and rebounding standpoint.

Worried about lack of depth on wing and bench scoring at the 4-5 when starters are out. Deberry was a nice option to have. This team has a lot of potential if we can avoid significant injury or at least be healthy at the right time.

I hope for improvement from the returning guys too...but realistically, if we stay with the same pace of play, the improvements can really only come from shooting at higher %s for most. Evans may be the exception to that, if we choose to run more through him. But when there are only in the ballpark of 60 or so possessions in most games (not including the cupcake games), there are only so many shots to go around.

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Its nice to focus on individual performances but many times a guy improves because the players around him improve. Evans and Clark's game will grow simply by being healthy. Both were limited last year Evans more so then Clark. Having a center who doesn't travel or turn the ball over at a high rate will help. Washington is a good passer and can stretch the floor which could impact the effectiveness of other players. Scott will help on the offensive glass. JJ can take a few minutes away from TC which may keep him fresh for longer periods of time. it also will protect us from foul trouble. I can use the same logic for Moore and Brooks. Generally after the season Coaches always evaluate individual performances and give the players a list of things to work on. Handle, shooting, conditioning to name a few. If one guy improves it may help the other guys game is my point. TC's game will jump if Evans becomes the player we all think he can be. TC and Clark will rise if Washington creates space.

[L-T]

Originally Posted by WAITE HOYT 2

Lol!! I thought that may be your answer.

Are you going to the game Thursday?

Waite, I have tickets, but unfortunately I have a conflict and can't attend. But, I will be watching.

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Originally Posted by L-T

Waite, I have tickets, but unfortunately I have a conflict and can't attend. But, I will be watching.

I was going to buy you a cold one. the wife and I will be there. May be next time? I hope to bring home a winner. This will probably amuse you but your level of confidence in Mick is about on par with mine for TT. Hermen is a up and comer. I put the check mark in their side of the ledger in coaching for this one.

[L-T]

Originally Posted by WAITE HOYT 2

I was going to buy you a cold one. the wife and I will be there. May be next time? I hope to bring home a winner. This will probably amuse you but your level of confidence in Mick is about on par with mine for TT. Hermen is a up and comer. I put the check mark in their side of the ledger in coaching for this one.

It certainly hasn't been lost on me that the things I started saying about Mick, which earned me "Anti-Christ" status on these forums, are now being said about TT by many posters and about the same exact timing (3-4 years after his hiring) as when I started saying them about Mick. People don't even want to let him get to the end of his contract. I at least was receptive to Mick coaching thru his contract.

It will be interesting to see the reaction tomorrow "after" TT wins tonight. I am very typically slow to want a coaching change. I would have been happy staying the course with Tony Yates instead of hiring Huggs (dumb thought in hindsight). For me, the incredible high and excitement and "FUN" of being a Bearcat basketball fan during the Huggs years was something I loved so much, that when Mick started moving thru his years as coach, his recruiting was disappointing, we were playing too many cupcakes and a brand of basketball that was almost nauseous, and I melted down quick. For me, it was like being a millionaire and then suddenly being homeless. But now, I've been homeless for so many years that I'm just a shell of my former self and I'm just numb...lol. My attitude about Mick hasn't changed, but he never goes away, so now I'm just hoping that he keeps learning, changing, etc. and finally gets it.

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Originally Posted by L-T

It certainly hasn't been lost on me that the things I started saying about Mick, which earned me "Anti-Christ" status on these forums, are now being said about TT by many posters and about the same exact timing (3-4 years after his hiring) as when I started saying them about Mick. People don't even want to let him get to the end of his contract. I at least was receptive to Mick coaching thru his contract.

It will be interesting to see the reaction tomorrow "after" TT wins tonight. I am very typically slow to want a coaching change. I would have been happy staying the course with Tony Yates instead of hiring Huggs (dumb thought in hindsight). For me, the incredible high and excitement and "FUN" of being a Bearcat basketball fan during the Huggs years was something I loved so much, that when Mick started moving thru his years as coach, his recruiting was disappointing, we were playing too many cupcakes and a brand of basketball that was almost nauseous, and I melted down quick. For me, it was like being a millionaire and then suddenly being homeless. But now, I've been homeless for so many years that I'm just a shell of my former self and I'm just numb...lol. My attitude about Mick hasn't changed, but he never goes away, so now I'm just hoping that he keeps learning, changing, etc. and finally gets it.

I see some similarities but also some glaring differences. TT inherited a stable program playing in the AAC. Funds were plentiful to the football side of things. Where as Mick inherited a dumpster fire. A very popular coach drank his way out of town. It was also known that Huggs was assembling a monster team when he left. Leaving a very bad taste in everyone's mouth when he showed up at KState with those guys. Mick Was starting out in big East with a huge gap in recruiting. Basketball was put on back burner while the football program was supposed to lead us into a P-5 conference. TT represented a name coach who had won a National title. Cronin was a local guy out of Murray st. With ties to UC through Huggs who also happened to leave for a opportunity with Louisville and Pitino. Something that didn't endear himself to the fans..i do agree it's time to move beyond what we are getting from both. Mick certainly gets paid well and has been given a long leash. It's put up or shut up time. I actually thought last year we were going to turn the corner but a ton of heartbreaking losses took care of that. Mick's teams have done well but it's time to go beyond well. TT and football have been on a downward spiral since his reign started. It's time to right that ship. If not it may be time to look elsewhere.

[L-T]

Originally Posted by WAITE HOYT 2

I see some similarities but also some glaring differences. TT inherited a stable program playing in the AAC. Funds were plentiful to the football side of things. Where as Mick inherited a dumpster fire. A very popular coach drank his way out of town. It was also known that Huggs was assembling a monster team when he left. Leaving a very bad taste in everyone's mouth when he showed up at KState with those guys. Mick Was starting out in big East with a huge gap in recruiting. Basketball was put on back burner while the football program was supposed to lead us into a P-5 conference. TT represented a name coach who had won a National title. Cronin was a local guy out of Murray st. With ties to UC through Huggs who also happened to leave for a opportunity with Louisville and Pitino. Something that didn't endear himself to the fans..i do agree it's time to move beyond what we are getting from both. Mick certainly gets paid well and has been given a long leash. It's put up or shut up time. I actually thought last year we were going to turn the corner but a ton of heartbreaking losses took care of that. Mick's teams have done well but it's time to go beyond well. TT and football have been on a downward spiral since his reign started. It's time to right that ship. If not it may be time to look elsewhere.

Waite, I see it completely different than you. Mick was the one who came into a stable "program", but with a shallow bench. However, the program was added to the greatest conference in the world and he should have been able to fill that bench back up quickly with great recruits who were familiar with the great tradition of this program, the great facilities, and who wanted to play in the bright lights of the true elite basketball conferences in the land. Didn't happen. TT on the other hand, came to an unstable situation, a program going thru its 2nd coaching change in 4 years, and a program just booted from a power conference with an automatic bid to the elite bowls, to a mid-major conference with little chance to ever get to the big games. Cronin had the easier path.

[UCalum08]

Originally Posted by L-T

Waite, I see it completely different than you. Mick was the one who came into a stable "program", but with a shallow bench. However, the program was added to the greatest conference in the world and he should have been able to fill that bench back up quickly with great recruits who were familiar with the great tradition of this program, the great facilities, and who wanted to play in the bright lights of the true elite basketball conferences in the land. Didn't happen. TT on the other hand, came to an unstable situation, a program going thru its 2nd coaching change in 4 years, and a program just booted from a power conference with an automatic bid to the elite bowls, to a mid-major conference with little chance to ever get to the big games. Cronin had the easier path.

I have to respectfully disagree. I understand your spin but it's way off base. Mick has surely had a more difficult path. I think your personal feelings for Cronin is twisting your faulty logic.