Xavier

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by waterhead

We are going to have to work with Vogt given the fact that Brannen seems to play Diara only out of necessity (even with Sorolla out).

Diara's mobility and skills should fit in very nice...so once again...there is more than meets the eye with Diara and the eye isn't saying nice things either.

I am sure he would be a better option on D but I can't really say if he is missing assignments to help etc. If we can keep Vogt in the paint he is very efficient on offense. Brannen wants quick decisions to be made and from what I can tell Diara isn't the best at making those.

It depends on the eye. I've said for quite a while that Diarra should be getting more minutes. I didn't have the stats, but the stats Justin posted line up quite well with what my eye test has said.

In my mind, Diarra and Vogt are just about equally skilled players. It could just be that Brannen values offense from his bigs and doesn't care about the defense (or he blames the guards and doesn't think Vogt should ever need to help). In that case, Diarra's best bet is to transfer out.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

looks very clear. very good defending on the block on post ups. very poor on spot ups.


when he guards his man 1 on 1 in the post he's very good. when he helps off penetration and then is forced to rotate out to the 3 point line he struggles tremendously. I don't believe our bigs were asked to do that in the past because we didn't play stricly man defense.


Break down is pretty simple. Vogt's man has attempted 17 3's and made 10 of them at 1.765 points per possession.


That is clearly a problem, but we're talking about less than 2 shot attempts per game and guys are hitting at a rather insane rate for a center even if they are wide open.


I like to see .6 ppp on post ups. Those 3's put everything way out of whack and I'd expect those numbers to go way down just based off average college 3 point shooting.

Our bigs frequently rotated out to the 3 point line in the past. Far more then they do this year. In the past we switched everything. Cronin's defense demanded athletic bigs to function. Vogt would likely not even get on the floor for a Cronin team.

Kyle Washington moved significantly better than Vogt does. But Washington struggled tremendously in Cronin's defense.

I do expect the percentage to come down against Vogt. Just because of law of averages, they aren't difficult shots. Vogt either has to let guys shoot an open jumper or press them and let them drive by him. The open jumper is the better of two bad options, so he will continue to let them shoot it.

We are also going to be facing a lot more good teams coming up. I expect them to do their best to draw Vogt out of the paint and exploit his inability to guard jumpers and play help defense. I'd be using Vogt's man to set a lot of screens if I'm the opposing team.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by waterhead

or he can start playing better basketball when he gets a chance?

Diarra played excellent in the first half against Xavier. We went on a run with him in the game, largely because of his play. He was +6 or +8 in the first half. Then he barely got in the game again.

[cincrulz11]

Originally Posted by justinhub2003

I’ll look when I’m home later.

Keep in mind, Brooks was the guy guarding the 40 year old bald white guy on Wichita state and did it pretty damn awesome. He contested and he missed the game winner. Uc won.

yeah he was more capable of that than vogt for sure.

[cincrulz11]

Originally Posted by skyblade

Our bigs frequently rotated out to the 3 point line in the past. Far more then they do this year. In the past we switched everything. Cronin's defense demanded athletic bigs to function. Vogt would likely not even get on the floor for a Cronin team.

Kyle Washington moved significantly better than Vogt does. But Washington struggled tremendously in Cronin's defense.

I do expect the percentage to come down against Vogt. Just because of law of averages, they aren't difficult shots. Vogt either has to let guys shoot an open jumper or press them and let them drive by him. The open jumper is the better of two bad options, so he will continue to let them shoot it.

We are also going to be facing a lot more good teams coming up. I expect them to do their best to draw Vogt out of the paint and exploit his inability to guard jumpers and play help defense. I'd be using Vogt's man to set a lot of screens if I'm the opposing team.

we did it in different ways though. we switched all screen with cronin and thats how you could get a brooks defending a guard.


thats why im intrigued as to how many 3's opponents were taking vs bigs using that system.



also the stats showed vogt can't guard 3's, but how many centers do we play that typically have 3 point shooters? we've played vs some, but im not so sure the aac has those guys. it didn't show him struggling against midrange simply because i think there had only been 1 midrange shot taken against him.

[Gocats]

Not a surprise

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

we did it in different ways though. we switched all screen with cronin and thats how you could get a brooks defending a guard.


thats why im intrigued as to how many 3's opponents were taking vs bigs using that system.



also the stats showed vogt can't guard 3's, but how many centers do we play that typically have 3 point shooters? we've played vs some, but im not so sure the aac has those guys. it didn't show him struggling against midrange simply because i think there had only been 1 midrange shot taken against him.

I'm a little curious about that. I recall BGSU especially hitting quite a few of what I considered to be "midrange" jumpers when Vogt was guarding them. Freemason hit a couple for Xavier as well.

I'm not sure if Synergy didn't consider them to be Vogt's man for one reason or another. Or if they were close enough to the basket that they got counted as a post-up. I suspect the former, which makes me wonder if Vogt's defensive ppp should be even worse than it is.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

we did it in different ways though. we switched all screen with cronin and thats how you could get a brooks defending a guard.


thats why im intrigued as to how many 3's opponents were taking vs bigs using that system.



also the stats showed vogt can't guard 3's, but how many centers do we play that typically have 3 point shooters? we've played vs some, but im not so sure the aac has those guys. it didn't show him struggling against midrange simply because i think there had only been 1 midrange shot taken against him.

I don't think a lot of the threes hit against Vogt were by the opposing center. I suppose we could get Justin to watch the videos and tell us.

My guess is that the threes against Vogt are when Vogt's man sets a screen on our guard. Vogt hedges the screen and is left guarding the smaller guy briefly until our guard recovers. I'm guessing that brief period counts as Vogt "guarding" the smaller guy and Vogt leaves a big enough gap that the guy can basically take an open three.

Looking more at the breakdown, it's looks like spot ups and no dribble jumpers are where Vogt has given up high ppp's. I'm curious how accurate synergy is at assigning who is guarding whom. Or maybe my memory is just bad. I would have said that jumpers were a major weakness for Vogt, but I recall more mid-range jumpers and 3's off of the pick and roll than Synergy list.

[cincyguy13]

Originally Posted by skyblade

Diarra played excellent in the first half against Xavier. We went on a run with him in the game, largely because of his play. He was +6 or +8 in the first half. Then he barely got in the game again.

Honest question, why do you think brannen wouldn’t play Diarra if he is as good as you think? You think he wants to lose games? Why didn’t cronin play him. You have 2 college coaches and 95% of people that watch him play telling you he isn’t good enough. Maybe you are right and everyone else is wrong. I just don’t know what everyone would be missing that you are seeing.

[TheLongHaul]

Originally Posted by cincyguy13

The Vogt hate from sky blade is getting weirder. Saying brooks was better, I at least get that, but saying Diarra is better is like saying kelvin Gaines was better than Gary clark.

this is a great take. Frankly it's a litte bizarre even from someone that is so biased against this staff, and is pretty much so ridiculous that it's not worth arguing. No one in their right mind thinks Diarra is better. Vogt is most likely the MVP of the team so far this year.

I hope Diarra puts it together. Seems like a good dude and does have potential. But potential only gets you so far.