North Carolina Central

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

he has a very long track record of playing worse players while the better guy rides the bench. cronin is gonna play his guys, he doesn't care if the other guy is better. we go through this with a player nearly every single year. caupain to evans to cumberland to broome to johnson. never ending cycle. unless cronins guys gets hurt and hes forced to go with the better player (guyn and shaq getting hurt to let caupain and evans take over)


Guyn, KJ, Shaq, Jenifer those guys never had the talent to be starters logging all those minutes for us. But dang it if they didn't still do it.

All of those examples are of a veteran player getting minutes over a freshman. And in many of those cases the younger/better player was getting as many if not more minutes by the end of the season. Guyn transferred out, likely because he'd been told Caupain would start the following year. Cumberland was matching or exceeding Johnson's minutes at the end of the year.

Cronin has the younger players slowly work their way up and earn their minutes. But by the end of the season, they generally getting at least half of the minutes. Logan will probably follow the same trend with Jenifer.

Cane is a senior and should be one of the veterans Cronin generally prefers to give playing time, especially early in the season. The fact that he is losing minutes indicates there is something else going on. Perhaps lack of effort or dedication in practice.

One of the problems is that he isn't playing PG (lost Cronin's trust), but LoJo is taking those minutes instead of him, which is the reverse of the usual trend with Cronin.

If this years trend continues and Keith Williams continues to develop, I wouldn't be surprised if Broome is left fighting for backup minutes with Moore/Frederick's.

[Patrick Bateman]

Originally Posted by skyblade

All of those examples are of a veteran player getting minutes over a freshman. And in many of those cases the younger/better player was getting as many if not more minutes by the end of the season. Guyn transferred out, likely because he'd been told Caupain would start the following year. Cumberland was matching or exceeding Johnson's minutes at the end of the year.

Cronin has the younger players slowly work their way up and earn their minutes. But by the end of the season, they generally getting at least half of the minutes. Logan will probably follow the same trend with Jenifer.

Cane is a senior and should be one of the veterans Cronin generally prefers to give playing time, especially early in the season. The fact that he is losing minutes indicates there is something else going on. Perhaps lack of effort or dedication in practice.

One of the problems is that he isn't playing PG (lost Cronin's trust), but LoJo is taking those minutes instead of him, which is the reverse of the usual trend with Cronin.

If this years trend continues and Keith Williams continues to develop, I wouldn't be surprised if Broome is left fighting for backup minutes with Moore/Frederick's.

He isnt playing PG because that is not his natural position, that is why Cronin moved him

[cincrulz11]

Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

He isnt playing PG because that is not his natural position, that is why Cronin moved him

yeah so jenifer can dribble to half court and then pass it to broome and broome can start the offense and jenifer can rotate and stand in the corner.


its kinda comical thats how it works when cane is in there with jenifer. cane can't be a PG, but he can initiate the offense. hmmm

[waterhead]

Cronin does a very good job in regular season because he can focus on D and squeak out enough wins while teaching his lessons along the way. Play your veterans and your effort guys. Use the bench a lot for lessons.

The problem is...when it's time to play the superior player (in tourney) they are still shell shocked from worry about mistakes and they were under played all year so they don't have as much experience as players on other teams.

You can't play safe and scared in tourney. You need some confidence and freedom to use your natural abilities and instinct. We aren't going to defense and effort our way through March Madness. You have to let your play makers make plays and live with a few mistakes.

Something is not working in tourney...and it's not a coincidence. It's a byproduct of the coach and system. I would be much happier making the dance every other year if it meant we could play more freely each year with our best players and make some tourney runs. If that means we go NIT every other year...so be it. Even if we do it would have likely been a much more fun brand of basketball to watch for the fan getting to see the true stars play more.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

He isnt playing PG because that is not his natural position, that is why Cronin moved him

I can't really see him getting significant minutes outside of PG though. Broome is undersized even for a PG (as is Jenifer). At UC's level of play most teams are playing four guys who have 4/5 inches and 50 lbs on Broome. And he is competing for playing time with guys (Williams/Moore/Fredericks) who have 5 inches and 50 lbs on him.

As Mick said, we can't afford to have too many non-athletes on the floor at once. And Jenifer has a major advantage over Broome because he plays PG and we need ball handlers and floor generals on this team.

Broome is really the biggest loser of Evans going pro, Evans ball-handling made it possible for Broome to play off ball. Maybe Broome plays anytime Johnson is in. But I expect Williams to improve on offense and play with Johnson at times. I'd guess by conference play, Jenifer and Johnson will be splitting minutes at PG, Williams will be getting 25/30 minutes at SG and Broome will be maxing out at 10-15 minutes at SG.

[cincrulz11]

Originally Posted by skyblade

I can't really see him getting significant minutes outside of PG though. Broome is undersized even for a PG (as is Jenifer).

Broome is a PG though and he played better at the position last year than Jenifer did.

73 points 39 assists 12 turnovers 35.5% from 2 36.1 % from 3


114 points 48 assists 19 turnovers 48.1 % from 2 42.1% from 3



that was in conference play. lets not revisionist history this and try to act like jenifer was the better player last year. broome was by far.



defense was elite when either one was on the court. mick is making a clear statement. what you do on offense is completely irrelevant. if you dont play perfect on defense in his mind you won't play. it doesn't matter if you bring more overall value to the team.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

Broome is a PG though and he played better at the position last year than Jenifer did.

73 points 39 assists 12 turnovers 35.5% from 2 36.1 % from 3


114 points 48 assists 19 turnovers 48.1 % from 2 42.1% from 3



that was in conference play. lets not revisionist history this and try to act like jenifer was the better player last year. broome was by far.



defense was elite when either one was on the court. mick is making a clear statement. what you do on offense is completely irrelevant. if you dont play perfect on defense in his mind you won't play. it doesn't matter if you bring more overall value to the team.

How many of those minutes was Broome actually running the point though? Evans/Cumberland ran point a lot when Broome was in last year and Broome was exclusively off ball by late in the season.

I'm not saying Broome shouldn't be running PG. PG is his only way to get significant minutes given his lack of size (and Jenifer's lack of size). But all signs point to that not happening this year and thus I don't see Broome getting major minutes.

I don't think it entirely has to do with defense though. It also had to do with turnovers and Broome not running the offense how Cronin wanted it to be run. Broome was pulled quite often for his offensive decision making last year.

[cincrulz11]

Originally Posted by skyblade

How many of those minutes was Broome actually running the point though? Evans/Cumberland ran point a lot when Broome was in last year and Broome was exclusively off ball by late in the season.

those guys only really ran it when we went to mick ISO ball, which is not a good offense anyway. mick appears to think you can ask any good player to be SK. But you can't

Originally Posted by skyblade

I don't think it entirely has to do with defense though. It also had to do with turnovers and Broome not running the offense how Cronin wanted it to be run. Broome was pulled quite often for his offensive decision making last year.

yeah they scored points when broome ran it. mick hates that.

[skyblade]

Originally Posted by cincrulz11

those guys only really ran it when we went to mick ISO ball, which is not a good offense anyway. mick appears to think you can ask any good player to be SK. But you can't

Nope, it started as being the last 5 minutes of games. Then it was last 10 minutes if Broome was in. Eventually Broome was off ball any time he was in the game.

[waterhead]

Originally Posted by skyblade

How many of those minutes was Broome actually running the point though? Evans/Cumberland ran point a lot when Broome was in last year and Broome was exclusively off ball by late in the season.

I'm not saying Broome shouldn't be running PG. PG is his only way to get significant minutes given his lack of size (and Jenifer's lack of size). But all signs point to that not happening this year and thus I don't see Broome getting major minutes.

I don't think it entirely has to do with defense though. It also had to do with turnovers and Broome not running the offense how Cronin wanted it to be run. Broome was pulled quite often for his offensive decision making last year.

If Cumberland could do it last year (defacto PG) he can do it this year. Williams can probably do it at times as well. Even playing off ball Broome is going to be defacto PG at times when he gets to the top of the key.

So all of this is mostly about getting the ball up the court which I think Broome does fine with for the most part. When Broome is in we can run the weave starting with him off ball and when Jenifer is in he can pass from side to side from the top of the key. We shouldn't be doing side to side passing much anyway because we don't have any bigs on the block to throw entry passes to that can score with any regularity. Not to mention our 3 point shooting isn't good.

I don't think Broome will be limited in minutes because of his size. Jenifer is the one limiting us because of his size. Now we have to have our 2nd best PG on the floor and likely our 2nd best scorer on the bench because of this. Are we going to have to wait until late season for Johnson to win the spot for Broome to play more than 15 minutes?