upstate game thread

[Nomadic1]

Originally Posted by CaptDale

Blocks are blocks. They don't differentiate them in the stats. You think JJ only blocks players his own size or bigger? Space eater? For a freshman he moved pretty well. I suppose you like Big Dave? Mick needs to come up with a game plan to defend Kirk. It going to have to go beyond the swarming defense. Whatever he comes up with will lay the groundwork for future encounters with competent bigs.

Kirk isn't representitive of the prototypical center. He shoots a lot of jump shots, some from beyond the arc. I don't think there is another big we'll meet this year quite like him. Euro-style bigs are actually pretty rare in the college game.

As for the rest, I'm sorry but blocks are not just blocks. Some require a 6'11 guy to simply put his hand up to a 6'1-6'3 guard driving the ball. You think Buchanon would last long jumping out of the gym like Jackson for his?
A space eater isn't inherently a stiff, he moved okay but his rebounds weren't out of his area or anything. He got those boards on virtue of his size. Kid wasn't crazy athletic or pulling acrobatic feats to get them.

[JackBauer151]

Originally Posted by L-T

You have no idea what went on between Mick and Pitino either. So, in absence of the facts, we can only take Pitino at his word, which is a direct quote, and the quote says, "If Mick had asked first, he would have been on the schedule." It's hard to argue the only fact we have been presented, and it came out of the mouth of a Hall of Fame coach who is Mick's friend. No reason for him to lie.

You accuse me of nonsense when your post is full of more nonsense than you accuse me of......for instance....."the schedule is getting better." Maybe you didn't read my earlier post. Our schedule strngth today in Kenpom is 348 of 351. Now, unless last year was 351, 350, or 349, it's pretty hard to say our schedule is getting better. Then you say..."Mick's first 5 years here were a disaster. Who would want to play us?" Well, after 50-some years, Ohio State jumped right on board to play us immediately for the easy win. For every reason you guys say Mick can't schedule anyone good, I can counter with reasons why we should have had our pick of good opponents. i.e....Let's get Cincinnati while they are down. It's a high profile program that suddenly sucks. They have name recognition, so there's a huge upside. It looks like a far better win and comes with little or no risk. Ohio State obviously thought so.

On this site, hearsay, conjecture, and assumptions will always trump facts. The facts say Mick is a really good Xs and Os coach. He does a lot with a little. But, the job is a lot bigger than Xs and Os. The head coach is the face of the program and is the frontman in selling it to fans and recruits and I don't think he has done well in this area. The trend line is still going up, but at a slow pace. I'll say it again.....he's a damn good coach, but he needs to improve in some of the other areas of his job to reach elite status, or to get this program to elite status.

I never claimed I did know. You are the one making assumptions Im saying I dont know. Very convenient you use a stat that talks about today being 348 out 351. Lets see how that stat looks after the next 3 OOC games we play. Overall schedule is getting better not just the snap shot you just offered. For the 3rd friggin time I agree UC needs to do a better job of getting better cupcakes. All of those counter arguments are nice but they dont line up with reality. Teams dont schedule other teams because of what it looks like or a chance to kick a good program while they are down. It is all about building your resume and protecting the interest of your program. OSU knew we were cupcakes and the dynamic has always been us bitching about them never playing us. They killed two birds with one stone. That dynamic didnt exist with any other high major. Also from Mick's perspective why would he bring in all these high majors (If they actually wanted to come in and play) when his team is absolute shit. He was trying to rebuild something. Need as many wins as you can get to reassemble the perception of the program. Now that has been rebuilt and we are getting better games. I hope that trend continues but its still an argument that doesnt carry weight when you claim its all Micks fault for things that are out of his control. I do actually agree with you about him not being that good of a salesman. He definitely needs to be better at that. And the very last line in your post I have said in my previous ones.

[bearcat18]

I find this whole schedule argument stupid. We can't change anything so no need to get worked up over it. Only thing we can control is attendance. Go to the games no matter who we play. Go watch OUR team - not our opponent. Yea, some games are flat out terrible to watch at times, and I would love for the powerhouse teams to come to Fifth Third too, but it isn't going to happen like many want. With the way this team plays defense and hustles, they deserve more fans to show up. If you can't appreciate just watching our team play I don't know what to tell you, regardless of opponent.

Everyone that wants us to play more local small schools are assuming those teams want to come here and play or have open spots on their schedule. Nobody here knows what goes on behind the scenes when putting the schedule together. I'm sure Mick isn't telling OU, Kent State, or WKU thanks but no thanks. And please, adding NKU, Bowling Green, Evansville, etc. isn't going to add thousands to our attendance or create any more buzz. There are only a handful of mid-majors that could do that.

You also have to remember that some of those MAC-type schools would want a 2 for 1 series. Off the top of my head I know we had to play at Wright State, UAB, Miami, Marshall and Toledo in recent years. Not saying we are above everyone else and should refuse to play those teams on the road, but what would people say if we lost to one of those teams on the road? I'd guess a lot would question why we played them at their arena in the first place.

Yes we will need to schedule tougher with the new conference, especially next year without Louisville, but like Jack said, this isn't a video game where you can play any team, anywhere, on any date at any time. Money, TV, location, arena availability, calendar date, and more things have to add up.

[JackBauer151]

Originally Posted by bearcat18

I find this whole schedule argument stupid. We can't change anything so no need to get worked up over it. Only thing we can control is attendance. Go to the games no matter who we play. Go watch OUR team - not our opponent. Yea, some games are flat out terrible to watch at times, and I would love for the powerhouse teams to come to Fifth Third too, but it isn't going to happen like many want. With the way this team plays defense and hustles, they deserve more fans to show up. If you can't appreciate just watching our team play I don't know what to tell you, regardless of opponent.

Everyone that wants us to play more local small schools are assuming those teams want to come here and play or have open spots on their schedule. Nobody here knows what goes on behind the scenes when putting the schedule together. I'm sure Mick isn't telling OU, Kent State, or WKU thanks but no thanks. And please, adding NKU, Bowling Green, Evansville, etc. isn't going to add thousands to our attendance or create any more buzz. There are only a handful of mid-majors that could do that.

You also have to remember that some of those MAC-type schools would want a 2 for 1 series. Off the top of my head I know we had to play at Wright State, UAB, Miami, Marshall and Toledo in recent years. Not saying we are above everyone else and should refuse to play those teams on the road, but what would people say if we lost to one of those teams on the road? I'd guess a lot would question why we played them at their arena in the first place.

Yes we will need to schedule tougher with the new conference, especially next year without Louisville, but like Jack said, this isn't a video game where you can play any team, anywhere, on any date at any time. Money, TV, location, arena availability, calendar date, and more things have to add up.

Completely agree 100%

[Patrick Bateman]

I remember before the season even started and everyone was talking about the schedule saying that with a lot of fresh faces that the weak start would be just what the team needs. If the soft part of the schedule got the frosh's feet wet, and allowed some chemistry to take place than is it worth it? Especially if we play with the confidence and the smothering defense we did last night and get into the NCAA, the schedule could be useful. This is definitely the softest part of the schedule, it gets a lot tougher now. We still have about 25 games to play, it is definitely a marathon.

[bearcat18]

Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

I remember before the season even started and everyone was talking about the schedule saying that with a lot of fresh faces that the weak start would be just what the team needs. If the soft part of the schedule got the frosh's feet wet, and allowed some chemistry to take place than is it worth it? Especially if we play with the confidence and the smothering defense we did last night and get into the NCAA, the schedule could be useful. This is definitely the softest part of the schedule, it gets a lot tougher now. We still have about 25 games to play, it is definitely a marathon.

This is also a great point. Not only was it helpful with the freshmen, but also with some older guys who have new and bigger roles this year. It has definitely helped Jackson, Titus and Ge'lawn. You can see them getting more comfortable each game. Throwing them into the fire right away could have been trouble. They might have learned from it, but their confidence levels are at an all time high right now. I like where we are as a team going into our tough OOC stretch coming up.

[Robert]

Well, I'm glad some of you are perfectly happy with watching crappy, no-name teams come to Fifth Third. There is nothing wrong with having some cupcakes on your schedule, and yes, it is good for the young guys. But this early stretch is ridiculous. The games against the North Carolina teams were a part of a pre-season tournament, so I understand that. It was a great 4-game stretch to get the young guys acclimated, with one respected opponent on national television sprinkled in there.

But if you want to see attendance rise, you can't follow that up with UMass-Lowell, Kennesaw State, and USC Upstate. I am CERTAIN that we can get teams like Miami and Ohio to play us at Fifth Third. If it is a 2 for 1, so be it. Playing Dayton would be good for RPI and great for both fan bases. It will put butts in the seats at both of our arenas. Are they not asking us to play? Then let's ask them! Be proactive. Replace 2 of those 3 garbage games with any combination of Miami, Ohio, NKY, Wright State, or Dayton and you're looking at much higher attendance and better RPI potential without making your schedule a murderer's row.

[Robert]

And I still think playing 7 straight games at home to open the season is silly. Spread the home games out a little more and you might see an increase in attendance.

[Bearcat04]

Expected OOC SOS: 125

That's better than teams such as Louisville (184), Pitt (200), and Indiana (240) to name a few. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill. Sure, the schedule could improve, but this is far from a terrible OOC schedule.

[Robert]

Originally Posted by Bearcat04

Expected OOC SOS: 125

That's better than teams such as Louisville (184), Pitt (200), and Indiana (240) to name a few. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill. Sure, the schedule could improve, but this is far from a terrible OOC schedule.

You're probably right about making a mountain out of a molehill... Our schedule for this season was probably mostly set 2 years ago before everybody left the Big East. In other words, yes, we should give them the benefit of the doubt this season. But in the future, we need smarter scheduling... home games spread out a little better, more effort to play quality mid-major teams that will help attendance, etc.

Pitt is in the ACC and Louisville will join them there next year. Indiana is in the Big Ten. And Indiana and Louisville have rabid fan bases with national names -- in other words, they can schedule whoever they want because fans will show up regardless. And all 3 have better arenas than we do. Plus, the Big Ten and ACC are arguably the best conferences in college basketball, so their OOC RPI isn't that important. The issue we were talking about though is attendance, and one obvious way to help attendance is to schedule better.