Caupain

**waterhead** · 12-09-2013, 12:48 PM

I was a doubter coming into the season. I thought he was too slow and that would be exposed when he got in the game. I have been completely wrong so far. We need someone other than SK, JJ, and TR to step up if we want to have any kind of deep run. I have been looking at his stats and am just as impressed with them as I am of his composure on the floor.

I broke down some stats by per minute played rather than per game to see what kind of effeciency TC and other players are giving us. Just to highlight his stats I will list his ranking first with some commentary.

Pts/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 3rd on team with TR (SK, JJ)
Ass/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 1st on team (SK) (big difference between #2 and #3)
Steals/min...#3 on the team (TR, ST)
Reb/min...tied for #1 among guards (SK)
3 pt%...#2 on the team (SK) (not a per minute stat)
FT%...#2 on the team (SK)
FG%...he's #6 (but he's #1/min getting FT's so this is skewed a little by fouls)
TO's...He's actually 3rd highest on team but slim margins between 2nd-8th (just to give you an idea there is a greater margin of difference between #1 and #2 as well as #8 and #9 than there is between #2 and #8)

(disclaimer...I did not included DN or JDIII in these comparisons because of low minutes)

Robert · 12-09-2013, 01:21 PM

Like I said before, being fouled has nothing to do with FG%. However, being able to get to the free throw line absolutely does raise your offensive efficiency. That's why James Harden was near the top in all the efficiency ratings in the NBA last season despite having an mediocre FG%.

That said, I'll take a point guard who goes 40% from the field but gets to the free throw line 2-3 times per half and makes nearly 90% of his attempts.

Scheids21 · 12-09-2013, 02:07 PM

http://cincyontheprowl.com/2013/12/0...arcats-lineup/

Check this out.

**waterhead** · 12-09-2013, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scheids21

http://cincyontheprowl.com/2013/12/0...arcats-lineup/

Check this out.

LOL. That's a strange coincidence...but I gotta agree with the guy.

We need someone to step up and take control of the wing minutes. If it's not ST or JS I wouldn't care at this point if it's GG, KJ, JL, TC, or JDIII. If we assume TC should start...it's going to have to come from one or two of the other 4 players.

**waterhead** · 12-09-2013, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert

Like I said before, being fouled has nothing to do with FG%. However, being able to get to the free throw line absolutely does raise your offensive efficiency. That's why James Harden was near the top in all the efficiency ratings in the NBA last season despite having an mediocre FG%.

That said, I'll take a point guard who goes 40% from the field but gets to the free throw line 2-3 times per half and makes nearly 90% of his attempts.

Thanks for setting me straight on FG% and FT's. I guess it would make sense that missed shots on fouls not be counted toward FG%.

**waterhead** · 12-09-2013, 03:51 PM

I went on a site called statsheet to get a few more ways to look at stats for TC compared to the rest of the team. There were two other stats that stood out to me. Offensive Rating and True Shooting %. I googled both for defintions but only came up with one...however here are the ratings.

Offensive Rating...TC 121.3, SK 113.4, KJ 97.5, JS 94.5, ST 93.6, GG 90.9, TR 87.1, JL 85.3, JJ 84.6 (I don't know the input for the rankings)

True Shooting % (which is the relation of your total points to things like 3%, FT% and I think maybe FG%)

TC 58.5, SK 55.8, JJ 49.6, GG 47.5, JS 47.4, ST 43.9, JL 43.5, TR 41.4, KJ 36.5

So whatever reason SS feels these stats are important to monitor...TC leads both categories for the team. Now I know if he shot the volume that SK does things would probably change in SK's favor...but it does lend to his efficiency and effectiveness on the court. Outside of our big 3 he has attempted about as many shots as the other guys (everyone else is between 37 and 44).

(sorry I went back and checked again and the individual pages show something different than the team page...I will update the numbers soon)

Disregard...there is a big difference from the team page and individual pages for all players so I don't know which is true and which is not.

L-T · 12-09-2013, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterhead

I was a doubter coming into the season. I thought he was too slow and that would be exposed when he got in the game. I have been completely wrong so far. We need someone other than SK, JJ, and TR to step up if we want to have any kind of deep run. I have been looking at his stats and am just as impressed with them as I am of his composure on the floor.

I broke down some stats by per minute played rather than per game to see what kind of effeciency TC and other players are giving us. Just to highlight his stats I will list his ranking first with some commentary.

Pts/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 3rd on team with TR (SK, JJ)
Ass/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 1st on team (SK) (big difference between #2 and #3)
Steals/min...#3 on the team (TR, ST)
Reb/min...tied for #1 among guards (SK)
3 pt%...#2 on the team (SK) (not a per minute stat)
FT%...#2 on the team (SK)
FG%...he's #6 (but he's #1/min getting FT's so this is skewed a little by fouls)
TO's...He's actually 3rd highest on team but slim margins between 2nd-8th (just to give you an idea there is a greater margin of difference between #1 and #2 as well as #8 and #9 than there is between #2 and #8)

(disclaimer...I did not included DN or JDIII in these comparisons because of low minutes)

Completely agree with you here. I was a big time doubter on Caupain. But, he is unquestionably the one shining star of this early season. He's improving by leaps and bounds. He is gaining confidense. And, he's starting to make jump shots. This definitely could end up being one of Mick's best classes....although it doesn't take much to win that distinction. Caupain, Johnson, and Lawrence are already significant contributors. In the few pregame warm-up sessions that Morman participated in, his athleticism was off the charts. I won't hold my breath on Strickland. Mick's track record with centers is not very good, but if he pans out...along with Morman, we may have something very good in a year or two. Love Caupain!

**waterhead** · 12-09-2013, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-T

Completely agree with you here. I was a big time doubter on Caupain. But, he is unquestionably the one shining star of this early season. He's improving by leaps and bounds. He is gaining confidense. And, he's starting to make jump shots. This definitely could end up being one of Mick's best classes....although it doesn't take much to win that distinction. Caupain, Johnson, and Lawrence are already significant contributors. In the few pregame warm-up sessions that Morman participated in, his athleticism was off the charts. I won't hold my breath on Strickland. Mick's track record with centers is not very good, but if he pans out...along with Morman, we may have something very good in a year or two. Love Caupain!

Good stuff! I would add that we have Moore and Debarry coming in with Strickland. I would hope we can get one of those guys to pan out as a productive low block player...preferrably Moore or Strickland since they will have 4 years.

I also can't wait to see Mormon...it will probably take him a year like most players. I agree with your assessment that we will start to see a much better product two years from now. This year we can be good but not sure we are top 15 potential. Next year we will be inexperienced.

I am not writing off this year or next but I am very excited about the following years. I know we have been waiting a while but that is when I think we are going to really start to shine in rankings. Mick Cronin type players with BB IQ, athletecism, and offensive talent.

If we can just add to my Xmas list (for our last recruit this year and two next year) a pure shooter and defensive eraser center. Adding another stud PG would not hurt my feelings. If we can get those 3 things I feel like we will have a complete arsenal.

bearcat jeff · 12-09-2013, 04:55 PM

I have always loved Caupain. Overall with the new pieces this team isn't assertive offensively. And though they lack shooters I think they have some guys that can score. Thomas could be a scorer, KJ could be a scorer and of course SK can be a scorer. Caupain already understands he needs to be aggressive in order to impact the game. In that way he is ahead of the curve.

TheLivingLegend · 12-09-2013, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearcat jeff

I have always loved Caupain. Overall with the new pieces this team isn't assertive offensively. And though they lack shooters I think they have some guys that can score. Thomas could be a scorer, KJ could be a scorer and of course SK can be a scorer. Caupain already understands he needs to be aggressive in order to impact the game. In that way he is ahead of the curve.

"Thomas could be a scorer".... losing faith in this happening. Year three of the program. limited to no signs of offensive ability.

12-09-2013, 12:48 PM	#1
waterhead Senior Moderator Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 9,298	Caupain I was a doubter coming into the season. I thought he was too slow and that would be exposed when he got in the game. I have been completely wrong so far. We need someone other than SK, JJ, and TR to step up if we want to have any kind of deep run. I have been looking at his stats and am just as impressed with them as I am of his composure on the floor. I broke down some stats by per minute played rather than per game to see what kind of effeciency TC and other players are giving us. Just to highlight his stats I will list his ranking first with some commentary. Pts/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 3rd on team with TR (SK, JJ) Ass/min...in a virtual deadlock tie for 1st on team (SK) (big difference between #2 and #3) Steals/min...#3 on the team (TR, ST) Reb/min...tied for #1 among guards (SK) 3 pt%...#2 on the team (SK) (not a per minute stat) FT%...#2 on the team (SK) FG%...he's #6 (but he's #1/min getting FT's so this is skewed a little by fouls) TO's...He's actually 3rd highest on team but slim margins between 2nd-8th (just to give you an idea there is a greater margin of difference between #1 and #2 as well as #8 and #9 than there is between #2 and #8) (disclaimer...I did not included DN or JDIII in these comparisons because of low minutes) Last edited by waterhead; 12-09-2013 at 01:14 PM.

12-09-2013, 01:21 PM	#2
Robert Elite Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 1,030	Like I said before, being fouled has nothing to do with FG%. However, being able to get to the free throw line absolutely does raise your offensive efficiency. That's why James Harden was near the top in all the efficiency ratings in the NBA last season despite having an mediocre FG%. That said, I'll take a point guard who goes 40% from the field but gets to the free throw line 2-3 times per half and makes nearly 90% of his attempts.

12-09-2013, 02:07 PM	#3
Scheids21 Epic Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 1,692	http://cincyontheprowl.com/2013/12/0...arcats-lineup/ Check this out.

12-09-2013, 03:51 PM	#6
waterhead Senior Moderator Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 9,298	I went on a site called statsheet to get a few more ways to look at stats for TC compared to the rest of the team. There were two other stats that stood out to me. Offensive Rating and True Shooting %. I googled both for defintions but only came up with one...however here are the ratings. Offensive Rating...TC 121.3, SK 113.4, KJ 97.5, JS 94.5, ST 93.6, GG 90.9, TR 87.1, JL 85.3, JJ 84.6 (I don't know the input for the rankings) True Shooting % (which is the relation of your total points to things like 3%, FT% and I think maybe FG%) TC 58.5, SK 55.8, JJ 49.6, GG 47.5, JS 47.4, ST 43.9, JL 43.5, TR 41.4, KJ 36.5 So whatever reason SS feels these stats are important to monitor...TC leads both categories for the team. Now I know if he shot the volume that SK does things would probably change in SK's favor...but it does lend to his efficiency and effectiveness on the court. Outside of our big 3 he has attempted about as many shots as the other guys (everyone else is between 37 and 44). (sorry I went back and checked again and the individual pages show something different than the team page...I will update the numbers soon) Disregard...there is a big difference from the team page and individual pages for all players so I don't know which is true and which is not. Last edited by waterhead; 12-09-2013 at 04:04 PM.

12-09-2013, 04:55 PM	#9
bearcat jeff Hoops Moderator Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,502	I have always loved Caupain. Overall with the new pieces this team isn't assertive offensively. And though they lack shooters I think they have some guys that can score. Thomas could be a scorer, KJ could be a scorer and of course SK can be a scorer. Caupain already understands he needs to be aggressive in order to impact the game. In that way he is ahead of the curve.